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« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2009, 01:07:27 PM »
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http://www.independent.com.mt/news.asp?newsitemid=91019

Interesting article about the possibility that the Pillars are actually to be found in Sicily and not the Strait of Gibralter...which could put Atlantis inside the mediterranean.

(put this into the wrong thread originally...)


Taking as given for the moment that the "Pillars" were in Sicily and not Gibraltar, an Atlantis outside of them would still have to be beyond Sicily from a Greek point of view, which disqualifies the litany of Aegean locations that archaeologists of dim imagination tend to ascribe to Atlantis as a knee-jerk.

Under a Sicilian "Pillars" hypothesis, the vista of possibility for sunken lands enters the range between Sicily in the east, and Gibraltar in the west (although lands outside of Gibraltar could still be considered as outside of Sicilian Pillars as well).  This includes a possible temporary sinking of Sardinia or Corsica, or islands in the western Mediterranean still sunk.  Or it could still be K. Margiani's Azores Plateau; or my more recent hypothesis of Iceland ("Ultima Thule").

"By a route obscure and lonely, Haunted by ill angels only,
Where an Eidolon, named Night, On a black throne reigns upright,
I have reached these lands but newly From an ultimate dim Thule —
From a wild weird clime, that lieth, sublime, Out of Space — out of Time." --Edgar Allen Poe
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« Reply #16 on: September 07, 2010, 03:01:46 PM »
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Hercules = Horus?

While studying the exploits of Hercules for my translation of the ‘Pillars of Hercules’ (http://www.riaanbooysen.com/terra-aus/87-terraproof1?start=10), I came to the conclusion that Hercules and Horus may have been the same person referred to in antiquity:

1. Both assisted the Gods in their battle against the Titans (Giants)
2. Both survived poisoning attempts through snakes (Horus/Seth, Hercules/ Hera)
3. Two of the twelve labours of Horus were the slaying of the Nemean Lion and the capture of the Ceryneian Hind. The so-called Healing Stela of Hours



shows Horus holding serpents and scorpions in his hands, but more significantly a lion by its tail and a hind by its horns as well. To me this suggests that it was actually Horus who had to perform these tasks, and that these tasks were in fact a step by step battle plan for defeating the Titans (see details at the link above).

Do you think there is any merit in this theory?

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« Reply #17 on: September 23, 2010, 09:56:29 AM »
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Hercules = Horus?

While studying the exploits of Hercules for my translation of the ‘Pillars of Hercules’ (http://www.riaanbooysen.com/terra-aus/87-terraproof1?start=10), I came to the conclusion that Hercules and Horus may have been the same person referred to in antiquity:

1. Both assisted the Gods in their battle against the Titans (Giants)
2. Both survived poisoning attempts through snakes (Horus/Seth, Hercules/ Hera)
3. Two of the twelve labours of Horus were the slaying of the Nemean Lion and the capture of the Ceryneian Hind. The so-called Healing Stela of Hours



shows Horus holding serpents and scorpions in his hands, but more significantly a lion by its tail and a hind by its horns as well. To me this suggests that it was actually Horus who had to perform these tasks, and that these tasks were in fact a step by step battle plan for defeating the Titans (see details at the link above).

Do you think there is any merit in this theory?


Etymologically it holds up and I would toss in an intriguing possible additional tie-in to Gilgamesh by way of the Kolbrin Bible's reference to that character's name as "Hurmanetar", which may refer to "Heru-ma-neter" (Horus the Divine) in Egyptian.  One sideways twist to all this is that Heru may have been an extremely ancient culture hero (of possibly Egypt, Atlantis, or the pre-Atlantean Turanic culture), and subsequent hero characters (to possibly include the English word "hero" itself) were given the Heru name as a paste-over for mnemonic facility, or possibly as an honorific.  Sort of like saying a new war hero is "an Audie Murphy of his time", similar construct.

"By a route obscure and lonely, Haunted by ill angels only,
Where an Eidolon, named Night, On a black throne reigns upright,
I have reached these lands but newly From an ultimate dim Thule —
From a wild weird clime, that lieth, sublime, Out of Space — out of Time." --Edgar Allen Poe
Paradigm shift happens.
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« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2010, 10:21:34 AM »
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Very nice Ciggy.

It seems to me that there are a lot of little assumptions one has to make—much like deciphering anything from the past—but you certainly present a very credible and convincing presentation. Once again your knowledge in this area continues to amaze. Thanks for the info.

-Doug

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« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2010, 11:12:11 AM »
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It's certainly not an exact science, which adds to the fun of paleoetymology.  Some of the principles involved are:

1)  Ancient people were fond of PUNS, as illustrated brilliantly in Robert Temple's "The Sirius Mystery" (though I disagree with his conclusion that the Dogon legend that served as his launchpad for research, was referring to outer space aliens).

2)  Words take on a genealogy all their own independent of what language originally spawned them.  For example a language like English can take on a word like "kibbitz" from Yiddish, without having to denote that English as a whole stems from Yiddish.  All it really takes for words to cross the language barrier, really, is *contact*.  Further, when words cross languages there is often, though not always, some variation of meaning that takes place in accordance with the new host culture of the word.  "Kibbitz" as used in modern English is ever so slightly different from the true Yiddish meaning of "Kibbitz", for example.

3)  "Sounds like" can be suggestive evidence of a word association across languages, regardless of language lineage (so long as there was contact), but in a vacuum of other evidence it's insufficient to make the assumption.  Kitchen etymologists of modern conspiracy theory are notoriously laughable when they jump up and down on thin ice such as claiming "Saturn" and "Satan" are identically from the Hamitic "ST" root (as shifted into Semitic with "Shaytan").  Sometimes a Saturnian cigar is only a cigar.  The sounds-like association should act as a suggestion and a pointer of where to go looking for other evidence, not the evidence itself.

4)  When one language adopts a word from a "contact neighbor" language, there has to be a reason for it.  Something in the significance of the word should have been important enough to the adopting language to take it on.  Sometimes the reason is that the adopting language had no previous native word to express the same concept; and sometimes the new adopted word expresses the concept more succinctly; and sometimes the word adoption is an expression of the adopting culture's attitude towards the word's source culture (such as when Tsarist-era Russians started dropping French words into their conversations, to show how cosmopolitan and sophisticated they were).

5)  When a word crosses the language barrier and changes along the way, the parts most likely to change are the vowels.  The consonants that change are most likely to retain some consistency with their previous ones, such as "K" changing to "T" or "CH" changing to "SH".  A drunken slur of a word can sometimes become the new official word, if the drunken speaker is a King, for example.  And the way inebriation will slur a word is culture-dependent.  :)

6)  To observe how a language can change within a migrant culture, one can observe clues within English and how it's changed in America from the original English of the United Kingdom.  In one way the migrant language is a "snapshot in time" of the original language, and it accumulates new loan-words from other languages it contacts along the way.  Concurrent with that, the source language continues to evolve along its own path, adopting different loan-words differently, and formulating new slang on a different cultural algorithm than the migrant language.  Over the course of hundreds of years with limited continued contact, the language splits into "dialects", and over a thousand or more years, into distinct languages (e.g., the Frankish as spoken in France, and the Frankish dialect of German in the home region of Frankfurt).

7)  It's nearly impossible for languages to come into contact without both of them taking on loan words from the other.  However, when one culture is dominant then the dominated culture will tend to adopt more from the dominant one (as a matter of political expediency).

8)  When people migrate, they bring their language with them.  It may change along the way, but subjectively they will view it as still being the authentic language.  Americans view their English as being "proper" English, for example.  If they cease to speak the original pre-migration language abruptly, without a devolution over time, then what really happened is that a colonization scheme has failed:  the indigenous culture defeated an invading migrant culture, or assimilated them peacefully.  "Spanglish" shows that migrating Mexicans, for example, are unable to hang onto their "Mexican Spanish" for long when immersed in U.S. culture.  It takes political dominance for linguistic dominance to prevail (which in many ways explains why immigrants try to achieve some form of political empowerment--so as not to lose their identity over the course of assimilation).

9)  Migrating languages have a "DNA" of their own, but words also have a distinct "DNA" (independent of word meanings), as explained in previous points about contact and loan-words.

10)  Culture influences the way words morph over time.  A time-conscious culture will look for more succinct and brief ways to express a thought, than a culture with a more relaxed relationship with time.  A warlike culture will introduce warlike synonyms and puns into a wider array of words.

11)  The volume of words denoting granularity of meaning indicates the importance of the described things in that culture.  (For example, the Aleut have 7 different words for "snow".  In Tahitian about 2/3 of the language comprises different species and subspecies of sea life.  English has a proliferation of words describing legal and artistic nuances, but only one word for "snow" and fewer distinct species names for varieties of fish.)

"By a route obscure and lonely, Haunted by ill angels only,
Where an Eidolon, named Night, On a black throne reigns upright,
I have reached these lands but newly From an ultimate dim Thule —
From a wild weird clime, that lieth, sublime, Out of Space — out of Time." --Edgar Allen Poe
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« Reply #20 on: July 26, 2017, 07:21:00 AM »
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I believe that Pillars of Hercules were the magnetic portals.
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